Friday, June 7, 2019

Can the Universe Have Arisen from Nothing?

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Sometimes it happens that, just as I begin to think that I am smarter than I really am, I get reminded otherwise.  Here is an exchange between two people, both of whom are smarter than me.  They were discussing the question of whether the universe could have spontaneously arisen from nothing.  The deeper question, of course, involves what nothingness is, and what “somethingness” is.  Here is what Nicholas and Simon had to say about the matter:
 


[Begin Quote by Nicholas Burk, Executive Board Member © 2019 Free Thought Initiative]

When I run into religious arguments against mainstream science, I often hear a line that goes something like this: “And what about the Big Bang? Now scientists would have us believe that something came from nothing. How absurd! Something is something and nothing is nothing and to think otherwise is nonsense! Besides, we never ever see something come out of nothing do we?”

Do we? Here is this common misconception in a nutshell: “The universe couldn’t have possibly popped into existence out of nothing.”

[Skip to next segment]

[Resume quotes by Nicholas—bolding by me]

Through mathematics and indirect observation of quantum fluctuations, scientists can now make the case that our universe did indeed come into existence out of what people call, “nothing.”

Now most people’s problem with this astonishing discovery comes from the use of this word, “nothing.” In everyday language, when we say nothing, we mean the opposite of something. We mean absolute emptiness, an unambiguous void. This pure, theoretical, and definition-based abstract doesn’t really exist. This idea isn’t exactly what cosmologists and quantum physicists mean.

[End quote, Let's turn to Simon]

[Response segment by “Simon”]

Hi Nick

Having once been an atheist, I find it interesting that when I now talk to atheists, I realise how powerful “confirmation bias” is on both sides in these discussions. Previously the idea of positing god as an explanation for the big bang was a bit like the atheist Stephen Hawkins famous description of never ending turtles on top of turtles - if god caused the big bang then who caused god etc. Quantum fluctuations underpinning spacetime, seething with ‘zero point’ energy seemed a far better hint at what could become a clearer, tangible answer.

Now my view of god is very different, and whilst I fully appreciate that science by definition must avoid untestable theories such as “god did it” from the process, I find that atheists are working with turtles. Ignoring for now the questions about the nature of quantum fluctuations, and how these manifest in a ‘universe’ that has neither space nor time, the god I believe in is absolute, not created and underpins everything. All energy ultimately comes from him and all time, space and quantum phenomena sit within him.

[End response segment]

[Now, for my comments] 

Nicholas has made a flawed argument, and Simon recognizes that.  The universe could have come from “nothing,” but only if you carefully re-define “nothing” as “something.”  Net zero is not “nothing.”  Plus one minus one equals zero, but in this case, that “zero” contains plus one and minus one, which clearly are not zero, and not “nothing.”  Even the vaunted Stephen Hawking stumbled on that matter.

Many atheists, having concluded that there is no God, cut their feet to fit their shoes.  Likewise, some of my fellow Christians make the most bone-headed arguments FOR God.

IMO, when we argue for or against (you name it, Idealism, God, atheism, physicalism) we should recognize that when it comes to ultimates and absolutes, human reason is inadequate to define them, much less to prove/disprove them.

We can at best only say WHY we believe as we do.

Thereafter, any further discussion should center as much on learning as it does on persuading.
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